.st0{fill:#FFFFFF;}

E2A 026: Double Your Impact with Dr Paige Williams – Why You May Not Want to Stop After Just One Book 

 March 29, 2022

By  Scott A. MacMillan

Writing and publishing a book is something many business owners aspire to do, but few complete. Why? Well, we know that publishing a book can help build authority and tap into new potential clients. But what happens when you add a second book to the mix? A different title. A different topic. A different reader journey. And possibly…even a different ideal reader. Chaos? Or catapulting credibility?

In this episode of The Entrepreneur to Author Podcast, your host Scott MacMillan talks with Dr. Paige Williams…researcher, author and trusted advisor to CEOs and senior leaders about her new book Own It! and how it ties in to her brand while also creating unique opportunities for growth.

GUEST BIO:
DR PAIGE WILLIAMS
 is an author, researcher and PhD in Organisational Behaviour. A trusted advisor and mentor to senior leaders across business, government, education and beyond, she uses a potent blend of neuroscience, psychology and her own twenty-plus years of international business leadership experience to surface uncomfortable truths and help leaders see the rules they need to break in order to breakthrough and lead themselves, their teams, and their organisations to thrive. The results are dramatic and measurable.

 CONNECT WITH DR PAIGE:
Instagram (@drpaigewilliams): instagram.com/drpaigewilliams/
Website: https://drpaigewilliams.com
LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/drpaigewilliams
Own It!: https://drpaigewilliams.com/own-it/
Becoming AntiFragile: https://drpaigewilliams.com/becoming-antifragile/
The AntiFragile Survey: https://theantifragilesurvey.com/ 


CONNECT WITH SCOTT
Entrepreneur to Author™ Select membership
entrepreneurtoauthor.com
grammarfactory.com
scott@grammarfactory.com

Scott on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/scottmacmillan/
Scott on Instagram: @scottamacmillan
Scott on Twitter: @scottamacmillan
Scott on Medium: @scottamacmillan

Episode Transcript

Please note: The transcript is produced by a third party company from an audio recording and may include transcription errors.

Scott A. MacMillan: 

You're listening to the Entrepreneur to Author podcast, episode number 26. (music playing)

Mike Manz: 

Welcome to the Entrepreneur to Author podcast, the podcast that brings you practical strategies for building authority and growing your business. And now, here's your host, Scott MacMillan.

Scott A. MacMillan: 

It's one thing to write a book and publish it. With that, you'll have accomplished a feat that many business owners aspire to, but few complete. Your book provides a focal point for your business, a lightning rod for activity, for attention, for opportunity. But what happens when you add a second book to the mix, a different title, a different topic, a different reader journey and possibly even a different ideal reader? Well that changes things, in many ways for the better. Further credibility, a wider net, more arrows in your quiver. But how do you make sure that you don't lose focus? How can you make sure that you don't go from being known as the go-to authority on a given topic to watering down that authority and being too much of a Jack or Jill of all trades? My guest today has thought deeply about her IP and how it knits together across multiple books, about how her books create a unified brand proposition while adding dimensions that would be difficult, if not impossible, to achieve with a single title.

Whether you're already published and are considering your next title or you haven't yet put pen to paper on your first book, but know in your soul that you've got more than one book in your future, you do not want to miss this edition of Entrepreneur to Author. My guest today is Dr. Paige Williams. Paige is an author, speaker, researcher and trusted advisor and mentor to senior leaders across business, government, education and beyond. She uses a potent blend of neuroscience and psychology to surface uncomfortable truths with leaders and their teams so that they can break through and turn disruption and uncertainty to their advantage. She's the author of Becoming Antifragile: Learning to Thrive through Disruption, Challenge and Change, first published in 2020, as well as her new book, Own It! Honouring and Amplifying Accountability. Paige, welcome so much to Entrepreneur to Author. Thanks so much for joining us.

Dr. Paige Williams:      

Thanks so much, Scott. It's just great to be here with you.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

Oh, lovely. So let's start by perhaps giving our listeners a little more about your background and experience that has led you to what you do today and for whom.

Dr. Paige Williams:      

Oh, sure. I'd love to. So my first degree is in business studies and I spent the first for 20 years or so of my career working my way up through various organizations until I was at the most senior leadership levels, had budget responsibility and perhaps more importantly, had responsibility for lots of people across multiple locations in Europe. And then as I traveled to Australia, I took a shift in direction and got involved in the early days of the field of positive psychology. And that's what led me to my PhD research where I examined what creates thriving systems, particularly in an organizational context, and really doubled down on leadership because my research showed and my experience told me that actually leaders are the most potent leverage point for positive change in any system, and that's whether that's an organization, whether it's a team, whether it's a family, whether it's a football club, actually doubling down on leadership and really taking a close look at how we're showing up in our own leadership and how we're helping others step into theirs, that's how we have a real possibility to create positive change.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

Yeah, that makes complete sense, right? If you address leadership, that has knock-down effects throughout the organization regardless of what that organization is. Yeah. So thanks for that. Now, you published your first book, Becoming Antifragile, in 2020. Could you share a little bit about your inspiration for that book?

Dr. Paige Williams:      

Yeah, sure. Absolutely. Well the irony is to write a book about disruption, challenge and change just before the COVID pandemic hits. And so I was in the final stages of it in February 2020 as our journey with COVID started to unfold. And so part of me was like, "Wow, great, what wonderful timing." But really what led me to write it wasn't the COVID pandemic. In fact, we've had these very deep, structural, systemic fragilities growing over a period of time, for the last 50 years or so, as we've created systems that really psychologically and socially and in terms of our relationships with ourselves and others they're just growing beyond our capacity to keep up. And so the book really speaks to how is it that we address this fragility?

And I came across the idea of antifragile, actually when I read Mark Manson's book about hope and he mentions the idea in there. And then I went back to the original work of Nassim Taleb, which is an amazing, very deep, deep read. And doesn't actually very much focus on human systems. And so as I read his work, which is socioeconomic and political systems, all I kept thinking was, "Wow, what could this mean for leaders and teams and organizations to become antifragile? And how could I translate what's a very deep and complex idea into something that really was a handbook and a guide that people could use every day?" So that was the inspiration behind it.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

 Yeah. And so now, you've just published your second book titled Own It! Could you share a little bit about Own It! as well and who is that written for? And what do you expect that they will get from reading it?

Dr. Paige Williams:      

Well, Own It! is another passion project. I wrote it at the beginning of Becoming Antifragile that I felt compelled to write the book. And I really did through my experience both as a leader and then as I've moved into my practice and working alongside leaders and helping teams to thrive and move towards their best performance. This idea of antifragile and moving beyond resilience, I taught resilience for so long, but it was really wasn't enough. And so Antifragile takes us beyond that and asks us the question how can we be better coming out of disruption and change than we were coming into it? And that's different to resilience rather than just bouncing back. But as I did that work, and not just with Antifragile, but as I've been a leader and as I've done other work with leaders and CEOs and their teams, what I've really found is that without accountability, which is the topic of Own It!, then nothing sticks.

So whether we're looking to develop anti-fragility, whether we're looking to make our transformational change program work, whether we're looking to meet the latest OH&S requirements, unless we've got a good sense of accountability, unless we can understand how to create that first in ourselves and then to ask others to step into their personal ownership, unless we think about what are we doing at a cultural level to create a context that enables accountability, then it's just like flushing water down a drain, all our energy, our resources, all our money in terms of any of the programs that we might be wanting to put through and create change in our teams and organizations is just a waste. And so I feel like Own It! is the upstream book from Antifragile in that one of the ways that we most often make and keep ourselves fragile is through a lack of accountability and a lack of personal ownership. And so let's do that work first because once that's in place, anything that comes after it will be more effective.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

Yeah. Perfect. Perfect. That makes so much sense. I find that many entrepreneurs have this goal of becoming a published author, and of course, few follow through with it, but fewer still go on to write a second book. So for you from a business perspective, why did you feel it was important to keep writing and to keep publishing beyond your first book?

Dr. Paige Williams:      

Well I think for me, there's a personal side to this in that I'm someone who is actively involved in research. I like to expand my own thinking. But also, I'm someone who's very pragmatic. So if we're going to work together, then I want that work to actually make a difference. And coming out of Antifragile and having published a book about thriving through disruption and challenge and change in the middle of a pandemic, it was important that the work was effective. It was important that the work made a difference. And yet, this issue around accountability and personal ownership, which is always a challenge, but particularly so when we're being stretched in many directions as we have been during the pandemic, so how can we call people to account? This is one of the central things I talk about in the book is that accountability has so much been used as a punitive form of punishment. When we want to have an accountability conversation, generally it's not because things are going well, it's often because things are going off the rails in some way.

And yet actually, if we reset accountability and we move it from that punitive tool of punishment to one that's actually about setting us up for success, if we step into our own ownership over having the right conversations at the right time with the right people, then that can make all the difference even as we might be spinning a thousand plates and feeling not at our best, feeling overwhelmed with the things that are going on in our context. And so Own It! is an invitation to actually shift our perspective around accountability from one of punishment to one that comes from a place of love, where we're actually saying to people, "I see you can play a bigger game. I've got faith in you, let's do this together." It's a real partnering process. So it's an invitation to something completely different. And even as we've navigated the pandemic and continue to do so, accountability is going to be crucial as we come out the other side as much as it was going in.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

Yeah. One thing that I really love about the title is to your point, accountability has for whatever reason, is probably not legitimate, but it has a negative connotation. But when you say own it, whether it's, "I'm going to own it, I want you to own this," it just completely changes how it's received, doesn't it?

Dr. Paige Williams:       It absolutely does. And it comes from that place of invitation. It comes from that place of partnering and let's have conversations about this. And throughout the book, I talk about accountability and responsibility from two perspectives, from the person asking for it, the accountor, and the person being asked for it, the accountee. And so there are different tools and strategies that we can use so that we get really productive, fair, effective accountability conversations going. But the first piece of that is for us to own what's ours to own in the situation that's going on for us. And so that's why Own It! is absolutely the first piece that we have to do in order to then be able to engage in conversations and create contexts that are clean and clear in terms of the accountability that we're asking of others.

Scott A. MacMillan:      Yeah. Yeah. So there's a clear hierarchy in terms of the IP, and I'd love to talk about the IP a little bit, the intellectual property. So now, you've got two books published. You've got two brands in the market. How do you think about these brands and the role that they play in your business? Do they work together? Do they serve different purposes? Are they subservient to your overall personal brand? Can you share how you think about that a little bit?

Dr. Paige Williams:      

Yeah, sure. So I think that the one thing I would say is that this is an evolving process. So when I wrote Antifragile, I absolutely wrapped my whole practice around the ideas in Antifragile. And what's beautiful and what really drew me to the idea was that it's a really big, expansive idea. So within Becoming Antifragile, I suggest there are six principles, the robust principles, that help us become antifragile. And we could take a deep dive into each of those and spend two or three months just exploring those together. And then I talk about antifragile energy attitudes and mindsets. And again, we could spend time deep diving into each of those. And then at the end of the book, I talk about from becoming antifragile to being antifragile, where we move from it being a set of tools and strategies to it being an inherent part of our identity. And again, there's a 12-month period of work that we could do together if I were coaching you, Scott, where we moved through the different aspects of the book.

So the one thing is that I would say that yeah, at the time I wrote Antifragile, I wrote it and what it afforded me from a commercial perspective was lots of opportunities and avenues to work with individuals, with teams, with whole organizations at different levels of depth, and also being able to really go narrow on one of the topics in the book, or take a broad overview of what does it mean to go beyond resilience and just a light touch on antifragile. Now, in the two years since I've written the book, my thinking's evolved, my practice has evolved. I've recognized this piece and got passionate about this piece around accountability. So that's the next book, but both of them are nested within my practice branding which is let's go over there. And so if you like, my overall branding is okay, let's talk about these uncomfortable truths, whether it's that actually you're making and keeping yourself fragile, or whether it's that you've got accountability issues in your team and that's what's fueling this epidemic of under-performance that you're experiencing.

These are not comfortable conversations that teams and individuals necessarily want to have. And yet, I know from my lived experience as a leader and from working alongside most senior leaders and teams that these are the conversations that make the difference, these are those breakthrough moments. And so from a commercial point of view, if we look at the hierarchy of it, let's go there, uncomfortable truths, dangerous conversations, inspiring insights is my practice branding. And then nested within that is Antifragile and Own It! as two subsets of what the flavor of those conversations could look like, and that then cascades into programs with CEOs, leadership teams, whole organizations, keynote speaking, et cetera, et cetera.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

Yeah, I got it. That's a really thoughtful way to think about it, Paige. Thank you. Now, how do you use your books in your business?

Dr. Paige Williams:      

So there's an input and an output version side of the way that books interact with the practice. So they're available for sale at all good bookstores and online. And of course, for some people that's their first contact with me is that they will see the book and buy it, and then they might then join my newsletter list and they might then join a webinar. I generally hold a webinar at least once a month on one of the topics, either antifragile or accountability. And so that's how they become part of my community. Sometimes that will also lead to a piece of corporate professional works and not just an individual, but that individual might be a purchaser within an organization. They might be an HR, they might be a leader and they've recognized actually do you know what? Can you come and work with my team? Or can you come and work with me? I want some coaching on this. And so that's where books can be inbound in terms of feeding the practice. They're great I think. So that's a small part of it though. What books mainly are about positioning?

So let me get that clear and out there. Number one is I write a book and I self-publish, and it's to get positioning in the market. So to be known for something. So I am now known as the person who does Antifragile other than Nassim Taleb who wrote the original book. I don't often Google myself, but if you do Google, "Dr. Paige Williams," it comes up as Antifragile. That was the purpose of that book was for positioning and leverage. And so now, I've got Own It! that's coming into the space as well. And so in 12 months time, I would hope that I'm just as high up if you Google, "Accountability," or, "Owning," or, "Ownership, personal ownership," as I am with Antifragile. So let's say first and foremost, books are about positioning and getting known for something. Secondly, they provide an inbound sales opportunity because people can find you through your book. And then thirdly, I'm now at the point where for any programs that I do, if they're the bigger programs I will provide an eBook copy of whichever book is appropriate.

And what that saves in my practice was I used to spend lots of time producing playbooks and workbooks to go along with the programs. But now, even if it's a program over a period of time and it only might cover an aspect of Antifragile or an aspect of Own It!, I'll still provide the whole book. One, because it saves me time producing a playbook, and also because there's a generosity to it that actually is worth the... It has more value than the dollar value of an eBook. And so for me, that's also where the books come into play is that they add value to my other offerings in a way that I couldn't otherwise do.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

Yeah. Perfect. Perfect. Let's shift gears for a little bit. I'd love to talk a little bit about your writing process. So what's your process for getting from idea to completed manuscript? And did you find that that changed at all from one book to the next?

Dr. Paige Williams:      

So yes, it changed significantly. I use Kelly Irving who's a fabulous book coach. And when I first wrote Becoming Antifragile, I wrestled with that process. I pushed back against it the whole way through and I wanted to do it my way. And Kelly was super patient with me and it was like, "No, let's just do it this way because I've done it with a few people before and it really works." So I trusted the system and did what Kelly suggested and it worked beautifully. And so the process is that, not to give Kelly's magic away, but basically the whole book is written in bullet points before you actually sit down to write any prose, and this is absolute gold. Let me tell you, I hate writing. I'm just going to put it out there. I hate writing. But what I do is I build up so much, "Oh, I've got to write, I've got to write, I've got to write," that I never quite actually get to doing it. Whereas Kelly's process hacks through that because you do all of your thinking before you actually sit down to write a chapter.

And so at any point when I wasn't feeling like I wanted to write, but I knew I needed to to keep up with the production schedule, then I would just pick up okay, what's the next section? What are the five or six bullet points I'm covering in this section? Okay, it's 500 words, I can do that. I can do 500 words on those five bullet points. And invariably, once I'd done those 500 words, I was in my groove and I could keep going. So Kelly Irving is great, big shout out to her. But also, if you are on this journey without a book coach, the idea of actually doing all of your thinking first, getting bullet points for getting the overall structure and then going through each section of your chapter and getting the bullet points down so that actually then when you come back to write your manuscript, you might tweak a few as you go, but the main thinking is done and you're much more able to get into the flow of writing is my experience.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

Yeah. Yeah. That's really the key, isn't it, to getting rid of writer's block is having a plan up front. And if somebody's listening and you're not familiar with Kelly, I'm a huge fan of Kelly, check out episode 19 I believe it is, Kelly and I had a great conversation. You can learn more about her process. But from a publishing perspective, Paige, you've been through the process now twice. What did you find surprising or frustrating or confusing about the process of going from manuscript to books in hand? And did that change at all from one book to the next?

Dr. Paige Williams:      

What I found joyful was having an editor, how fabulous is having someone else read your work? I mean that is just such a gift because you get too close to it and then the editor comes back and is able to see with clear and clean eyes what you are wanting to say or is able to come back and say, "What are you trying to say here?" Which is equally valuable. I don't think I found it anything surprising about the process. And I remember the first time I went through it, I was like, "I know nothing. I don't know how this works. I've never done this before." And actually recently, there's been a book produced called It's Your Book. I think it's come out in the last four weeks or so and it does literally step you through every step of the way of publishing a book.

And your beautiful book as well, Scott, takes us through this and I just so wish I'd actually read one of those before I went through the process, that would've been super useful. So I don't think I found anything surprising about the publishing process, just that it's actually complex. So I would say to anyone listening if it's your first time, do have a look into it so that you understand the overall process because I didn't, and it was a bit like fumbling in the dark to be honest. But I had beautiful people supporting me like you, Scott. So we got there successfully.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

I appreciate that. Yeah. It can be a little bit of an opaque process. There are a lot of moving parts. So that makes a lot of sense. Look, before we wrap up, I'd like to come back to your new book. What I find so authentic about a book like Own It! is that the journey that you take your reader on is so aligned with the journey that you help leaders and through when you work with them directly. I'd love if you could let our listeners know what type of reader is really going to get the most out of this book? And where should they go to learn more about it and about you?

Dr. Paige Williams:      

Oh, thanks so much, Scott. So Own It! is really for people who are perhaps frustrated by a lack of progress at work. They feel like they're the only ones who show up and do what needs to be done. It's for leaders who there's nothing going really wrong in their team, but there's just not the traction. There's not the forward momentum because the challenge with accountability is that it sits under the surface and it sits through the cracks. And often when people come and talk to me about us working together, they'll come to me with a surface level symptom, but actually what sits underneath it are issues with accountability.

And so really this is for anyone who's feeling frustrated, feeling not listened to, feeling like there's something going on, we're not doing and we're not achieving all that we could, but we're not quite sure why because on the surface everyone's looking okay, those situations are where Own It! and my work can help, particularly if you've got sticky dynamics where there's what I call a culture of politeness, where everyone's showing up and smiling and being plastic fantastic and no one's actually saying what needs to be said. So those are the scenarios where I know I can really make a difference and help things move forward in a productive and effective and clean and clear way.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

Yeah. And would your website be the best place for people to go to get in touch with you?

Dr. Paige Williams:      

Yeah, absolutely. So drpaigewilliams.com, that's where you'll find information about me, about the work that I do and also both books, Becoming Antifragile and Own It!

Scott A. MacMillan:     

Fantastic. Well we'll put that link in the show notes. Listen, thank you so much, Paige. This has been really great to talk to you and learn about your entrepreneur to author journey and how your publishing strategy links into what you do and how you serve your audience. So thank you again for joining us.

Dr. Paige Williams:      

Thank you so much, Scott. It's been great to be here with you.

Scott A. MacMillan:     

I know, I know, for those of you who haven't yet published a book, the thought of writing two may be overwhelming. But I assure you, once you've been through the process once, you'll see just how much you grow personally and how it impacts your business and how people perceive you. But first things first, focus on getting your first book written and the rest will fall into place. As we wrap up this episode of Entrepreneur to Author, remember this.

Publishing more than one book can be an effective way to position or reposition yourself in the market. It can add more depth or breadth to the expertise that you've already built with your first book. Although multiple books have the potential to complicate brand hierarchy, thinking of books as sub-brands of an overarching brand is a very effective way to benefit from multiple titles. And remember, detailed planning is what beats writer's block. If you've already fleshed out detailed bullet points for your entire book, then you'll never have to wonder what you're going to write next. Now is the time, time to write, time to publish and time to grow. I'm Scott MacMillan, until next time.

Scott A. MacMillan


Scott A. MacMillan is a speaker, international best-selling author, entrepreneur, and the President and Executive Publisher at Grammar Factory Publishing. He and his team help expert entrepreneurs write and publish books that build their authority and grow their business.

Scott A. MacMillan Signature

related posts:


{"email":"Email address invalid","url":"Website address invalid","required":"Required field missing"}

Get in touch